| Archive for uknhcp.myfastforum.org Natural hoof care resource forums for all those interested in barefoot horses |
| Nic |
April 2009...sorry chaps!N 
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| Nic |
Sorry all, it sort of slipped my mind that another whole month had gone by....
From our end, grass is growing and most of the horses are out at night, on the track during the day. Charlie, Hector, Felix, Bailey and Jacko are all hunting until the end of April, Ghost is schlepping about being an idle old bugger, and the latest rehabs are working hard at develpoing their heel first landings 
The new boys are another pair of "navicular" rehabs, one from Gloucester (Angel, 8 yr old bay Dutch warmblood who has been here about 3 weeks) and one from Cornwall (Blue, 10 yr old IDxTB who has been here a week), and both are doing very well. Will post pics of them on the blog before too long, time permitting ... N |
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| Nic |
I've locked the March topic, to encourage you all to start posting here while its still April 
Thanks, N |
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| hobnob |
OK just to recap so far this month.
On pp track with hay. For first time lgl pone is sound over everything out hacking WITHOUT boots!!! Can only think that I have changed form Hi Fi Lite as her supplement carrier to Fast Fibre a couple of months ago. Hoping back of foot will beef up in the coming months now we are bootless. |
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| rose |
I have had my girl on very very restricted grazing for about 4 weeks now. And she can no longer tolerate even a days grazing in her muzzle without coming in with quite strong pulses and going footy.
Had the farrier who thought her feet looked good but that her soles were thin. So they have recommended that I try her off sugarbeet and use fast fibre and try protexin probiotic and Trinty consultant's Tenderfoot 80. Has any one used these or know what is in Tenderfoot? Also is a probiotic sugar free? She looks fab but is footy on the road. I had a serious go without any boots for 3 rides but she just could not manage, if fact just got sorer. I usually ride booted in front only. I rode her out in boots all round yesterday and she was fine. I ride approx. 4 times a week for farily long rides of 2 to 3 hours and try to loose school her twice a week. I feel as she is stuck in such a tiny paddock she needs to get out each day. . |
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| hobnob |
I use Fast Fibre Rose. Its is great and only 2 percent sugar.
Hx |
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| cptrayes |
The only horse I have who is not getting pulses on grass is ........ my Shetland! He is still growing at two years old, so I can only put it down to that. They are all off grass from 9am to 7pm and so far that is keeping the pulse free. They go into my small barn, and there is a pen on the side so that they can get into the fresh air if they want, which they love.
New boy is a shirexIDxISH. BIG 16.3hh, bitter chocolate colour, almost black. Came with disgusting front shoes which were and inch wider than they were long. The length was "correct" if you can describe any shoe as correct  . The width was because the farrier had left him with wings, who knows why  He was toe first landing and tripping constantly without anyone on his back. He hasn't tripped since they came off, has twice the movement of the horse I bought  , and is sound on a one hour hack on the road and crossing a chipping covered carpark. I think he'll cope with no problems at all, as his feet have already shed all their chalk sole and are hard and shiny. The back feet had half an inch of horn and bar proud of the sole. That took some getting off  . The fronts were flat with collapsed heels and bars, but they already have a nice sole callous and some concavity.
Jazz finished the hunting season with a really tough day, with lots of cantering up stony paths. He was sounder and fitter than most of the field. So far, the in-during-the-day regime has kept him rock crunching. Fingers crossed. C |
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| SueH |
Current compromise of grass free pen 8-6 is workable in that boots remain off for Jake.
Trim last week was more of a tidy up as we've managed to do sufficient boot-free roadwork to wear hooves quite well. Jake wears front toes asymmetrically about hoof axis: more toward the outside - but interestingly symmetrically about his body axis. His breakover would appear to be offset toward outer part of toe. Perhaps this is making up for conformation of his upper joints: knees/shoulder etc. One problem is that he has got little stones wedged in white line area of left fore. I am trying Keratex (started 16 April 2009) to harded up area and see if that helps. He is still not happy on gravel which doesnt 'give' [eg. loose gravel on top of tarmac]. He is less happy about [i.e. tries to avoid] these surfaces after a long ride - as it the hoof has had enough after lots of work. However, as soon as the gravel disappears, even after a long ride and he hits smooth tarmac again, he is absolutely fine. I could boot him and ignore surfaces, but I'd rather stay out of boots and just avoid gravelly bits. I cant say he is that much worse now that when boots came off so I'm inclined to stick to grass-free-pen for daytime and allow him space of grass paddock at night for his sanity. He is moving and jumping extremely well on soft surfaces but does not like it lumpy. Have sourced local hay cut June but is fertilizer free + Timothy horsehage haylage + my Whitchurch hay which is an arse to get cos not local but is later cut. Going for variety of forage. |
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| evie |
Today's hoof piccies as we've not done any for absolutely aaaaaages. Comments welcome! http://www.facebook.com/album.php...amp;id=511281842&l=996ecbd088 RH is growing out blown heel from an abcess ?3 months ago. RF did the same thing 5.5 months ago, you can just see the very last bit of skanky hoof wall.
She's feeling very well and upferit :hooligan: - slowing down for corners is for WIMPS apparently... |
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| brucea |
All my guys fine - Bramble was a bit footy last weekend for no apparent reason but seems to be fine tonight - hormonal?
Spent a happy day in Cumbria getting in some practical experience trimming exmoor ponies in exchange for food and lodging for my children while I attended the active natural hoofcare course at Sarah's the following day (really good day - learned loads - quite thought provoking)!! All these wee ponies had just come down from the moor - hard little feet with wide solid frogs and full leather like heels! But the effects of quite a hard winter showing clearly on the older ones. |
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| SueH |
OK, its coming clear now, our golden rule is if the gravel gives, we like . If there is no give, we no like  . Harder ground (after dry weather) is not our favourite therefore.
Trying to get a balance between not being too tight versus not mollycodling the boy! I dont mind him picking his way but I do not like to see stumbling. The grass overnight is not helping, but its only marginally worse and I havent the heart to keep him in tiny pen 24/7. I will need to boot for certain rides as its outside his range. |
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| brucea |
Good day out with my big boy Link yesterday - hacked over to the forrestry commission woods and had a few good canters up the mountain bike tracks! Brilliant sunshine and a great day to be out.
Feet absolutely fine and not showing any ill effects from the grass which is roaring through now - a couple of mis-steps on very sharp crushings but I wouldn'd want to walk over that myself. He had a little wall height when we went out and after 4 hours he still had it when we came back - so off it came! Hardly wore them at all. |
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| Nic |
Sue, don't beat yourself up - its so much better to boot and ride than have him uncomfortable, when you can't control the grass, so you are doing the right thing
The important thing is that you are listening to your horse and recognising what the issues are that you can and can't control. N |
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| SueH |
Thanks Nic. I just got a bit over- excited and now I'm a wee bit disappointed. When I discussed whether to de-boot with Sarah I was just going to see how we coped and a drop off in performance was expected as I cant provide 24/7 grass free tracks. BUT what happened then is I was completely blown away by how amazing he was without boots compared to my expectations of feet falling off - dont laff . Then my expectations rose as the weeks went by and he coped with longer rides and more challenging surfaces. But then, recently performance on sharp stones was dropping slightly. I forgot along the way that he is rehabbing from a poor starting point - no heels whatsoever and so has always struggled on stones which we avoid. Now I know on your blog you say about transitioning:
"This is a classic, typically from people who know a little bit about barefoot and have heard that horses need to "transition" to stony surfaces. Of course the point is that horses with healthy feet can already cope with stony surfaces - so if they can't, you know that they have unhealthy feet..." Well, Jake does have unhealthy feet in that he has foal heels - they are coming but this will take time..... AND he appears grass sensitive. Problem is its difficult to say which is dominant factor in his lack of foot health. The question for me is if he had big tough heels, would feeding him grass overnight affect him sufficiently to need boots for stones ?? Time will tell I suppose. I do plan for him will come off grass altogether for trial period at least as soon as we get our own land. I suppose I could do it now as at trial for a week but it feels a bit mean being cooped up in a pen for a week, as knowing he is grass sensitive wont change the fact I cant keep him grass-free yet as its out of my control. I have noticed that with a little encouragement [food, excitement e.g. riding out with high energy horses or seeing new mares, racing friends) he forgets the surface. At least his is, despite having grass overnight, mega fine on smooth tarmac and last night's performance on road was fab to watch [see post "So glad we're barefoot"] Indeed he manages hours of roadwork with heel first landing.
x Sue |
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| Nic |
I sympathise...sometimes there is so much chicken and so much egg its impossible to unravel
The comment I posted on the blog is the sort made by people who think barefoot is JUST about toughening up (or worse, the sort of people who force their horses over bad surfaces thinking that is what they need). As you know, its often more complicated than that! We had a horse years ago that we tried to "toughen up" for ages, and after a few months she had great looking feet and the beefiest digital cushions you have ever seen, but still hated stones. At that point Sarah Braithwaite was telling me it was all about grass and I didn't believe her The same horse off grass is rock-crunching, on grass is a wimp over stones
In your situation, I would boot over bad surfaces, ride without when possible and get on with life - at least that way you are having fun and building the back of the foot as best you can
N |
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| SueH |
Yes its not as if its that difficult to cope with is it. The big deal is all in my head. We have lots of cool heel conditioning routes and for others, I will boot up. Things like jumping, stressage etc. can all be done bare as on soft surfaces - there is not reason why we cant get out there and have fun.
Last night J did 2 hours of roads and tracks, lots of trotting all totally fine. The one bit of stoney track has fluffy green central verges so we can walk on this bit and avoid stones. The more thinking I do on this ( it entertains me whilst I poo pick - I even talk to the bloody horse about it) I suspect grass is the baddie isnt it. After all I'm comparing performance on April (pm only) grazing versus performance on Feburary grazing NOT performance on zero grazing. Sarah B has always advised me it diet diet diet as prime factor of course........ |
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| Nic |
yep - April grass growth is serious, and will make a big difference IMO. I've under-estimated the impact of grass before to my peril
N |
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| brucea |
Well Nic - we had the yard dressage league last night. It was very interesting to sit and watch very discretely.
A number of horses were less than fully sound, some actually stumbling, others breaking in trot or canter. Some with slight unevenesses, changes of attitude at transitions, different stride lengths, or a subtle head bob on every second step, one or two throwing a wee strop when asked to go forward or just getting irritable. By the way the grass is growing so fast after the rain a couple of days ago that you can hear it squeaking. My guy is sound on the rough stuff - I was telling myself that anyway - but after Sarah's course last week I'm watching all the signs over the whole body - the ears are not in a go forward, happy mode on the rougher bits - they are back and he is looking for an easier path, slight hesitancy I wouldn't have noticed before. These UKNHCP courses are great, but they don't half make you notice things you'd rather not!!!!  Thanks Sarah...
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| SueH |
Yup April evils are here  .
today took wrong turn and ended up on gritty road. I had unhappy ears on rougher bits + looking for an easier path + hesitancy. Spent much of ride on verge [Luckily most rides round here have verge sections], unless tarmac smooth and then he's happy on that but not as happy as he's been. Gets on soft and he's all forward again. what would be good is a boot bag so i can take boots off when we get to smooth mossy tracks on mountain. |
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| Nic |
April grass is here, for sure. I am happy for the cows and lambs, but it means horse management is back to being more intensive 
Three of the horses here are showing the earliest signs of being less capable over stony ground than they were a few days ago, and so are coming off the grass altogether for the moment, particularly as we have had heavy showers last night and this morning after lots of warm weather. The rest of them though are fine out at night, and its probably no coincidence that its the hardest working horses who are able to cope best with the higher sugar levels in the grass at the moment. I've put another hunting clip up for those who were interested in the sort of ground we cover Please excuse my occasional inadvertent commentary
Its on www.rockleyfarm.blogspot.com or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnD-2Gg_CNk Nic |
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| hobnob |
Wow again Nic. Are your sure its not called mountaineering instead of hunting ! Felix's ears seem to always be saying "me first, me first !!" | ||||
| Nic |
Felix is an opinionated little tinker, but he is so good that he gets away with it
When we go down them, we do call them "black runs" - and occasionally the horses do ski down them
N |
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| sarahh |
Grass is growing like mad here in wiltshire, but so far so good (touchwood).
Horses still out 24/7 and Boy proved his rock crunchingness out on a fun ride this morning. Unfortunately the little s*** also proved its possible to rear vertical then pivot 180 degrees while still in the rear. Sigh. Luckillt the floor wasn't TOO hard as I tumbled off the side. Tyler is hacking a few days a week now and also rock crunching. I think soon they will be stabled in the and out at night, as soon as I see any signs of unhappiness from either of them. Until that time though tgey will remain abandoned out in the field! X |
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| brucea |
Must be an April thing Sarah - I went out the side door today as well. | ||||
| Terry |
Just had to share this, not funny really  a friend of mine who I regularly partner whilst competing at 80km plus came to ride this weekend, she has always ridden along side me on Abu so today she had a ride on him and we took Saqr and Medraar out as well. You don't realise just how fit your horses are when you are in a programme with them, my friend is used to speeds and varying terrain but the sheer look of horror on her face when we hit tracks and rocky drops and Abu just mountain goated down them.
She said an experience she wasn't keen to repeat but just couldn't believe she was riding a barefoot horse, no slipping, loads of traction and incredible grip down hill, he would make a good demo model for barefoot!! Terry 
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| Helen N |
Where did you take her Terry ?
With the antipathy towards boots from some quarters, I hardly dare post this  BUT Rooster was a star yesterday at the Croal Irwell Valley EGB ride in Greater Manchester, no mountains, but through suburban country parks, multi user paths, busyish roads, residential areas, industrial estates, over, under and alongside motorways, by rivers and canals, over a variety of different types of bridges including a very noisy metal one twice, past childrens' playgrounds, we even used a 'Pegasus' crossing. My 'country' horse was almost defeated by a small drop down into a stream, not helped by 5 other horses refusing to cross it also Many of the tracks were hard and stony so very glad I chose to boot him. We kept up a good steady pace and were rewarded with a grade one at the end of the 32kms. The Renegades he wore on his fronts look hardly worn, but the toes are gone on the Gloves he wore on his hinds, but I think they will be good for another 20 mile ride
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| brucea |
At £44 a boot it is dissapointing that the gloves are so short lived. We've done hundreds of miles in our Bares with the driving pony so I guess the gloves must be thinner, or made of softer material. | ||||
| Jo Mitchell |
Hi Helen
I am using the Gloves on all 4 on one of my horses so promise you no antipathy here about booting.... at ALL. I think that the consensus would be that if you can produce a perfectly performing feet on our horses then we wouldn't need boots... but the most important thing is to keep riding, keep exercising them and keep them comfortable with boots if needed. I'm a CP with the UKNHCP and so have a wealth of information, help and experience at my fingertips but despite all this... Pie still defy's my ability to "make" him produce a perfectly performing set of feet... norty boy!!!! I de-shod him just over 2 years ago and his feet are not that materially different from the day I first de-shod.... My mare who's hidous feet when she was in shoes got me started on the barefoot path.... are now perfect... go figure!! I have spent a fortune on analysiing blood, hair samples (over a 7 month period every 5 weeks!!!)... he is fed a great diet... I kept him off grass for long periods of time and nothing particularly has improved his feet for him to cope on long stoney rides without boots... I'm still hoping and trying and learning and listening to others and to other horses so our journey is still on-going... but until he is "perfect" on his feet I too will be riding in boots. But it is definitely not out of an easier life or lack of effort on my part that he needs boots still. BTW... I did about 80 miles over 5 rides last week and my gloves are still great, it may be the trotting on tarmac which is particularly bad for the toe of the gloves?, although I do think the breakover is better than on the others, do you? Jo Mitchell |
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| Helen N |
Hi Jo
Nice to hear from another boot user I chose the Gloves for Rooster's hinds because they are less bulky than any of the other boots and yes because of the lack of bulk the breakover is better. Of course the pay off for this is that they wear through quicker on Rooster because of his action. Without boots on a long ride with lots of roadwork Rooster will square off his toes, obviously with boots he will wear out the toes of the boots. When I bought him (nearly 4 years ago) he was shod, his hinds were bull nosed and the hoof convex where the farrier must have tried to address this problem. The hoof is a much better shape nowadays but he still wears his hinds down much quicker than his fronts. I put it down to his conformation and way of going and is why we need hind boots. Any way, because of his tendancy to drag his toes the Gloves stay put better than the Renegades. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. Terry, does Medraar still square off his hinds?
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| hobnob |
End of April report:
Still amazingly sound on all surfaces - feet growing like crazy. Having to re-roll weekly at the moment. Doing more work now. On track with hay soaked. |
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| Terry |
Helen, it would be easier to tell you where we didn't go!! Did a couple of those paths at the back of the Nant which are gated, grassy downhill tracks.
In terms of squaring toes Medraar is much improved thanks to long schooling sessions with Amanda and the use of a Passoa and poles he now works from behind much better and lifts his feet, I always school at least once a week now with him and also make him work deeper once a week whilst hacking. He will still occassionally have squared them after a long ride but all I do is round them off, he generally does this when he is telling me they are too long! I would imagine Rooster shows a little resistance to working over his back when out hacking judging by his tail over his back!! Well done for the weekend, fab result, it's a nice ride and local. Terry |
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| cptrayes |
Ummmmmmm - Nic I have watched your utube of hunting on Exmoor.
No hounds?????????????????????????????????????? Surely the definition is you follow hounds but I can't see none
C |
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| Nic |
Its because they go so bloomin' fast Seriously, they are there, but the limitations of my little camera mean that I can only clearly film big objects like horses in the immediate vicinity. Hounds are there, but are tiny white blobs moving at speed on distant hillsides If we are galloping you can bet hounds are the greased lightning 3 valleys on
Performance report from yesterday, we had a short day and gps declares that we did just over 35 km in 3 hrs 10 minutes. Nasty, nasty ground - either stony tracks or deep, wet ground, so bad for hooves and tendons, but horses all fine today. Sadly no headcam because we started off in sideways hail...
N |
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| Helen N |
You're right about that, he is working very nicely in the school now (he still has his weekly lesson), stretches down and offers to go long and low. The trouble is you can't do that for 20 miles plus!
Thanks, it's not a ride I have ever fancied doing but Angela persuaded me to go and I was glad I did You're off to Cranwell next? Good Luck
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| brucea |
Some results from last night's open jumping competition at the yard! There were about 10 entries in the minimus - kids got to start somewhere!
Ben (9) rode Link to get 1st in the minimus, and rode Bramble to get a 3rd in the same competition. Soemone asked me if I had super-glued his jods to the saddle! There was a big round of applause for Bramble - first time he's been jumping since his lami episode last year and he was just brilliant. We were all very proud of the little chap. Let's hear it for the no shoes approach to rehabilitating laminitic ponies! Becky (11) very bravely rode Apollo to a 4th in the same round - bravely because he'd been a little overexcited about the whole thing and hairy cob was in total Tigger mode! I'm really pleased for her because she's just starting to want to jump after having been well and trully put off jumping at PC Camp. Alas, poor old Dad ended up surfing the turf in the 90cm class and is a bit wrecked this morning. That'll teach me not to look down at the jump. Pillock - entirely my own fault. Quite spectacular though. Going to dust down the body protector for next time, should have been wearing it. 
Click to see full size image 
Click to see full size image |
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| Nic |
Hunting has finished down here today, and I have been so, so pleased with all my boys.
They have hunted for 9 months now, and Felix, Hector and Charlie have worked their little socks off. I have no idea how many miles they have clocked up, but its hundreds and hundreds, all barefoot, and they have done me proud. They have hunted at least 3 times a fortnight, sometimes twice a week, and in the last week Charlie has done 3 full days - Friday, Monday and today, which is a lot to ask of any horse, but he was still as cheerful at the end of today as if he had just been for a nice hack. We have had other horses out hunting too, and Jacko in particular has been fantastic, but those three have really flown the flag for barefoot. Felix has been ridden by 5 different people, Charlie by 8 and Hector by 4. They have gone on every possible type of terrain, but despite everything, when I turned them out tonight they went at a flat out gallop up the field, bucking and prancing all the way
They are very, very good boys and I love 'em to bits
N |
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| SueH |
For this horrid time of the year, navicular Jake's day-pen has been cut down as evil grass started growing in the mud section. The big draw back with a pen [v. track] is that he doesnt move sufficiently during the day, even with multiple hay stations so getting him exercised each day is essential.
Seems quite happy to chill out in the field shelter, but then teatime and he's ready at the gate to go out to bigger paddock. I did feel mean puttin him in small pen but then I was meddling with the gate the other morning before bringing him off the grass and he came pelting up and into the pen as if he was worried I was going to lock him out of his beloved field shelter. He remains fine on all but rocky ground where he struggles so we avoid. Still not put boots on as rides have been on road and grass verges a plenty round here and he's been very forward. I prefer not to boot and avoid the rocky bits as he feet seem to be doing so well with bootless exercise. Hacking out more with different ponies now, all v exciting for my riggy boy. Bucking is horrendous as ever if he's at the back and we all canter but he's been happier when allowed to romp off in front
Took him to local show to start him getting used to hullaballoo - first of the year. As expected, he lost it, 5 min rodeo and but worked him in space away from everyone and soon he'd got himself very together sufficiently to take him to explore working hunter area and pop over a fence. We'll get there
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| horsesfirst |
Did 5 hours today. I can report that most of me hurts. The Arab I think is fine. I walked/rode half and half. QH was ridden most of the way and is also fine. Both finished quite sassy and ready for lots more
Quails egg size flints on hard surface much more of a problem than huge, broken sharp flints on soft surface. Arab not as good underfoot as she has been. QH better than previously. Both in bare paddock by night and in during the day. Hay 24/7 plus supplements etc. The only sugar they get is what the landlord sneaks them when he thinks I am not looking. Arab demonstrated her voice training. Threw massive spook and about to leg it and I wasn't ready. So I yelled 'nooooooo, I'm not ready' and bless her she stopped. Companion said Arab's legs were shaking wildly. Not sure if this is because I yelled 'no' or because of the two fire breathing dragons thundering across the field in our direction (or were they Section A's?) |
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| brucea |
I have this picture of a guy in tweeds and plus fours sneaking around with a bag of Tate & Lyle and a big spoon!
I mentioned that I had a fall on Tuesday - well it was quite a spectacular one and unfortunately I tried the traditional equestrian martial art of breaking jump poles by throwing myself at them!!
Well - took pain killers and tried to tough it out, but got progressively worse all week until today when at one point I stopped the car on the road, switched on the hazards and waited to pass out....not good. My daughter insisted I go to hospital. Unfortunately I have fractured two ribs - nothing they can do about that - but also had a partially collapsed lung. Yep, it was a big needle, a bloody big needle between the ribs, and jolly sore. But breathing is easier now. Have three big boxes of pills - painkillers and antibiotics - and breathing exercises to do. Please all wear your body protectors when you're jumping. I really wish I had. It would have saved me a lot of pain. I am a pretty stupid pillock at times.
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| horsesfirst |
You are pretty close He gardens in his sunday best and the sugar is a handful of cubes hidden in his pocket - but the girls give him away every time.
Sorry to hear about your ribs - that will put the spanner in your trimming for a bit? Get well soon! |
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