| Archive for uknhcp.myfastforum.org Natural hoof care resource forums for all those interested in barefoot horses |
| CathyT |
Feed advice from you knowledgable people,,,please? xxxHi there,Before I start, I apologise as I posted this last night but managed to tag it on to the end of a thread!!! 
I have read THE book and love it. I have a new track system in the pipeline which I am excited about. I want to get the diet as good as I can get it without having to order bulk loads of feed from far away stockists. I guess you will need to know a little about my horses. Horse 1 - 17hh, Warmblood, 14 years. Currently doing a mixture of Dressage and show jumping. Horse 2 - 16hh, warmblood, 3 years. Unbroken and currently being a field ornament until next year as she still looks very immature. They live out 24/7 on an old pasture that contains alsorts of different grasses, herbs and weeds. They are both quite good doers. In the winter they have constant access to round bale haylage which is on a large concrete area and I intend to build on that area by creating a pea gravel track that they will use every time they go from the field to the haylage and vise versa. Mole Valley Farmers and Cornwall Farmers are the nearest feed merchants to me. I currently feed them Equilibra feed balancer. So guys I really need your advice. If these were your horses what would you feed them.
I have read a lot of other threads but the more I read the more confused I get. There is a lot of knowledge on here. You guys have been studying hard. 
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| CathyT |
Would something like
Hi Fi Lite Speedibeet Winter Glow/summer shine (Performance version) be good enough or should I add something else? 
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| brucea |
Your horses are individuals and have their own nutritional needs and preferences - and what you feed them has to work for them. So any advice here will just be what works for each of us
I feed straights - nothing pre-mixed Good quality hay Alfalfa (but not to the laminitics) - They don;t get on with HiFi Lite at all Linseed meal (can't praise this stuff enough) Seaweed Unmollassed beet Brewers yeast MagOx Succulents and cut herbs as they are available Also I feed some herbs for specific purposes, nettle, elecampagne, comfrey, chamomile, eyebright, dandelion, rosehip, liquorice, aniseed, mallow, agnus castus, neem and so on - as the horses need them. Rosehip and nettle are usually in the feed all the time though. Works for me, and my lads look glorious and are happy in themselves. I won't feed them cereals or anything containing cereals or cereal derivatives, and I won't feed anything where there is not full ingredient disclosure. |
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| Jo Mitchell |
Hi CAthy
You could also get a feed specification drawn up by independent equine nutrionist Clare MacLeod.. http://www.equinenutritionist.co.uk/ But I feed Speedibeet Simple Systems Total Eclipse Pure Lucerne Light grade mag oxide Alltech yea sacc before and after events, stress or if any of the horses have runny bottoms 1 tablespoon of seasalt after heavy work (ie if horse has sweated alot) I have a simple systems salt lick available to the horses in the field I will occassionally feed crushed oats if Pie is in complete full work and competition phase. I feed either organic meadow hay or later on in winter organic large bale haylage. I came to this feed regime after discussions and evaluation by Clare MacLeod... Jo Mitchell UKNHCP Certified Practitioner |
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| CathyT |
Thanks for your help.
I think the best thing for me to do is going and find out what my local stockists have and go from there? I think I confuzzle myself as I sooo want to get everything right and try and read too much in to everything.  I am a strange girl. 
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| brucea |
You're in good company here then! |
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| becnreps |
If you have read THE book (aka the bible to most of us ... )
then you're in pretty good stead really. The diet recommendations in there is basically what most of us feed. I currently feed: NAF Slimline, Speedi-beet, Linseed Meal, Mag Ox and a variety of herbs (like Brucea recommended). I also usually feed lucie stalks. However, at the moment, my horse is on an alfalfa free diet just to see if this improves his footiness. I am having problems with him being fairly footsore and am eliminating alfalfa first to see if it is that! Basically, read the labels on the feed bags! Many of us have tried Hi-Fi Lite and it is all well and good but it does still contain mollasses so can cause issues for some horses. The 'winter glow/summer shine' supplement you mentioned seems okay, it contains : "linseed, garlic, spearmint, seaweed and fenugreek". However, it is quite expensive and if you wanted a cheaper option, the 'straights' way (Bruceas way...!) would be best. Also, that supplement doesn't contain Magnesium (great for hooves) or brewers yeast (again, brill) and it contains garlic (which I think (  ) most of us like to stay away from).
As I am new to this whole thing too, I chose NAF Slimline as my boy needs to lose weight and I wasnt sure on all the quantities and also someone called Hobnob on here had some successes with it. It still contains seaweed, rosehips and magnesium but is a more expensive way to feed these things. Again, the supplement that Jo mentioned is also great if you'd rather buy 'premixed' as that also contains all the good stuff. Good luck ... diet is a complete minefield!
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| Sez |
I am feeding:
HappyHoof (I know it's naughty but they like it) Copra MagOx (and cheaper version of SS Total Eclipse below) Micronised Linseed Brewers Yeast Seaweed My old boy looks great on this. Last year he came into the autumn looking like a hatrack but he's thriving on the above diet. The linseed, brewers yeast, seaweed and magox are all easily available from the net, delivered. I bought 25 plastic jars from Ebay and mix the supplements on a day off (takes 5 mins) so it's much quicker to make feeds each day. |
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| hobnob |
Hi - I am the Hobnob becnreps talks about !!
I used Hi Fi Lite for years and years. Now switched to Allen and Page Fast Fibre and had huge event line on hooves to proove how much better it is for my ultra sugar sensitive babe !! They both have this with soaked meadow hay and their various supplements; Porky - IR pony and oh so very sensitive has, NAF Slimline, NAF Laminaze, Linseed and Hilton Metabolyte which is amazing. Little Man - immune to everything apart from midgey bites just has Global Herbs Globalvite general vit supplement and linseed, with GH Skratch in summer for his sweet itch. I also feed fresh herbs as and when, nettle, cleavers, thistle, willow, comfrey, hazel, yarrow all grow in the field. My girl lost loads of weight on the slimline. If you look at the NAF website, her before and after pics are on there under "Portia". |
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| CathyT |
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
I am certainly learning lots and seeing just what a personal thing this is. I am definately going to have to do some local supplier reasearch. Now I have some clue as to what other people use I can see what is readily available to me. I really do appreaciate your input. It also makes me feel welcome here.
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| horsesfirst |
You may find you have to order some stuff in - either via your feed merchant or by post. I have to. Where I live if it hasn't got sugar in it, it doesn't get stocked (even the linseed has added sugar) 
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| SueH |
Hi Cathy
Where I live there is one good feedstore whose owners believe in forage feed, no sugar etc so they do stock good stuff along with the crap. The rest of the local suppliers are confectioners really. I avoid all the 'hoof' cure all supplements as I'd rather control the individual doses myself. my personal approach was to decide on what you want first then see if they have it. if not ye olde internete is tres bien - e.g. Charnwood milling is a good supplier of the pure ingredients: unmolassed beet, alfalfa, linseed, seaweed, brewers yeast. Clare Macleod reviewed Jake's diet for me - fab job and very expert and informative, very sensitive to barefoot need, loads of follow up support to explain everything and all for £50. (not sure what the price is now) |
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| CathyT |
OK, I feel I can see a light at the end of the tunnel!!
You guys are great and have kept me off Facebook all evening!!! 
I have been researching and researching and am thinking my best bet is to buy online and get delivery to my door. I know that my most local feed merchant doesn't sell what I need and when time is tight I struggle to go much further. A question for those who buy the Linseed, Seaweed & Brewers Yeast separately. Is there a particular ratio that you mix to? Or is it equal amounts of each?
I am really looking forward to playing with this diet. My horse is fine on tarmac etc but isn't so good on forest tracks and stony going. Just slightly footy. So I am hoping this will make the difference.
Thank you once again for all your input.
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| brucea |
You know Cathy - I hate to say it - but I just give each horse what I think they need - there's little science in it
But in general it works out at about 2 tea mugs full of Linseed, two heap tablespoons of Brewers yeast (4 for the big lad) and about half a mug of seaweed. Precise measurements there.
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| Chris Thompson |
Absolutely Bruce - however, we have some widely different mug sizes in our cupboard from gentile ones at half a swallow to one that is nearly a pint (AKA the whale mug -it has a whale on it). And they are all tea mugs (unles of course they have coffee in them) I'll let you guess which is my tea mug 
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| brucea |
A normal, pedestrian, 25p from Tesco value range tea mug that we keep a half dozen at the yard - one just got "re-purposed" when the scoop went missing!
Not a tea-bucket! |
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| Chris Thompson |
Thanks Bruce:
Problem is we do not have a Tesco near to us. |
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| brucea |
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| Jo Mitchell |
Hi Cathy
Also, it's probably better to introduce the new feed slowly over a week or two, as if your horses have been used to lovely pre-mixes with high sugar content they will turn their noses up at their "5 a day healthy food"... They will in the end get used to it and look forward to receiving it... but you need to manage the switch over otherwise both you and the horses will become frustrated. Good luck Jo |
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| stormybracken |
Another thing I've learned is to introduce everything in separate buckets. When I combined new feed components the pony turned his nose up, although horse ate everything in sight, but now they are all in different buckets he eats everything BEFORE the horse/dog/chickens get a look in. This may be a temporary measure as I'm still working out quantities and what's working and what's not, but as I think it will be a constantly changing science due to grass and work factors it won't hurt me to carry on like this. | ||
| lazeearabians |
Advert in this weeks H&H for two new products from TopSpec=
TopChop Alfa TopChop Lite Both advertised as free from molasses and artificial preservatives. Anyone got any views on these new products? |
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| hobnob |
Wouldnt want to try the alfalfa one but would be interested to see what is in the other. The only trouble is, and call me synical, molasses free normally means it has molasses extract or something in it. Had a look on their website but so new its not on there yet !!! | ||
| Nic |
Not without a proper ingredients list If they are flash dried chops I'd avoid anyway, same as the other culprits out there.
N |
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| CathyT |
Thank you everyone!! Super stars, the lot of you!!
I have made headway with transferring to a cereal free/ hoof friendly diet and the track system should be in place by christmas. I should hopefully see some improvement with the new diet and then see more improvement with the track. I might put my track design up later on and would appreciate comments on how I could improve it.
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| horsesfirst |
Congrats on the efforts you are making Cathy T I am sure you will find it is worth it.
My old track was very basic, but the horses loved it. You should see improvements with the diet - the odd obstacle may crop up (largely sugar being given lots of 'creative' names and secret hiding places) but I am sure you will find your way round them. And for the super sleuths working out the wrinkles can be kind of fun
Best of luck and good wishes! |
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