One thing that always worries me about shoes is in the winter time when there is snow on the ground. I see quite a number of horses in the yard tottering around on high heels and on occasion tripping because of them - that stuff hardens and packs like concrete. _________________ http://www.4hooves.co.uk http://4hoovesblog.spaces.live.com/default.aspx
We had 2 days of torrential rain last week which turned our bone-dry chalky tracks into ski slopes. As a result, I changed the usual routes of the treks I took out to avoid the worst, but still had to come down one gentle chalky trail with sparse grass patches. All the horses slipped terribly, even on the grassy bits, and the girlie I was on, Molly, sat down twice as her bum went under her. All horses shod. Took my own big barefoot cob boy down the same trail next day following more overnight rain - this is the previous shod stumbler that would crash to his knees every outing - and he didn't slip once. I am still amazed at the difference in stride and 'feel' between shod and barefoot, and it's still early days for me, with every day throwing up a new story.
I was hacking out with The Tank (barefoot), Paddy (shod all round) and Jasper (shod on fronts).
We were all doing the same speed across the same ground.
The Tank was green but reasonably well balanced and didn't slip.
Paddy was highly schooled and didn't slip.
Jasper's owner has never bothered with lessons or schooling and Jasper was all over the place, and he sliped with all four feet.
Off all the miles The Tank and I have done and all terains, the only time he slipped (and fell ) was as a green four year old, on wet grass, in a spook, in canter. That was mostly my fault as he unbalanced me and I tipped him over with my weight . He has never been shod - perhaps that makes a difference?
Bare feet pack with mud too. I can only comment on what I feel under me traction wise, and that's my experience. I think this is one area where sometimes too many claims are made for barefoot, lots of things affect how an individual horse will go on slippery ground for better or worse.
...and with snow, but unlike with a shod horse, it tends to fly out every few strides, so hooves stay "cleaner" for want of a better description.
We can all only go by our own experiences, and every horse will react differently, but as you say with your own horses, you struggle with grass and so they probably don't have terribly good caoncavity. It may be this that is causing you and the OP more slip problems when out of shoes.
Quote:
Went BF end of Feb and back then we couldn't do much obviously
Don't quite follow this - what was happening in February?
Ah shoes came off and transition was gentle so never noticed or experienced the slipping. A big difference to clattering around XC courses now (til it rained)!
Quote:
With the change in yours, there could be several factors.
The increase in proprioception now compared to when shod could mean your horse is receiving more neural feedback about the ground underfoot, and is not able to compensate for this properly. If so, it should improve with time and mileage, and Pat's suggestions for getting him accustomed to the ground should help.
I can understand that and very willing to 'expose' her to help. I do wonder if I should ride differently, though I do allow her free rein, I do believe in letting them find their own balance than micro manage! but it's hard when the slips feel huge and we are about to go 'whopp-de-doo'
Quote:
If your horse is working harder or jumping higher now than previously, there may also be a fitness element - tired horses slip more, as do horses who aren't concentrating (youngsters goggling at everything can be a nightmare!).
Hmm no can't say we are suddenly doing more, not enough to tire her. She's reasonably fit.
Quote:
Flat feet can be more problematic, but even draft cross feet should have some concavity. What does your trimmer say about the feet? Is there an improved new angle of growth? If so the hooves should improve over the next few months.
Erm I don't have a trimmer, I do it myself and my pro-BF farrier occasionally checks balance. But I can put up pics of her feet if you like, they are well maintained and ok. They do have some concavity, more than when she was shod to be honest, which is great
Quote:
Bare feet pack with mud too
...and with snow, but unlike with a shod horse, it tends to fly out every few strides, so hooves stay "cleaner" for want of a better description.
Has anyone tried vasoline? Does that work to prevent or lessen packed feet? (of any material for that matter)
We can all only go by our own experiences, and every horse will react differently, but as you say with your own horses, you struggle with grass and so they probably don't have terribly good caoncavity. It may be this that is causing you and the OP more slip problems when out of shoes.
One has good concavity, one doesn't. I know it's a bit OT, but the horse who still has shoes on (for the next 2 days ) came in with mud packed feet last night, and I couldn't help noticing that it was packed to wall level rather than shoe level, ie the tread was still there.
Quote:
Has anyone tried vasoline? Does that work to prevent or lessen packed feet? (of any material for that matter)
My experience of using vaseline (on a barefoot horse) in snow is that it only works for a little while and then washes off.
I have one horse now who is my hunter who never, by any practical definition, worked shod. He is/was a terrible slipper. Since I knew that I wanted him hunting this season, I have made a point of exposing him to really difficult ground, and letting go of his head to force him to either find his balance or fall over. He never did fall over, and has learnt really quickly. Today he was in full gallop when all four of his feet went out to the right. I really thought I was a goner, and for two more strides he struggled to stay upright on the slick grass, but managed it.
So what? Well a month ago he would have fallen flat on his face, so basically I am echoing peoples' opinions that for some of them it is a question of learning what to do. A large part of that is to let them make mistakes and learn for themselves how to correct them, but it certainly can be nerve-wracking to do that with the worst ones!
Has anyone tried vasoline? Does that work to prevent or lessen packed feet?
I've never tried it, but then haven't really needed to, certainly in the snow - and we had a proper try-out with the snow in February:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2UBWg1afhs
Agree with Caroline, too, that its critical for them to learn to balance. Felix has never had a problem slipping when jumping or hunting, in fact the only time he did was doing a dressage test on grass as a 5yr old. A year later, no problem - more balanced so didn't slip.
Just to add my experience: P is well balanced and aware of where his feet are and very rarely slips. In the getting on for 2 years we've owned him we've had 3 slips that were sufficient to remain in my memory. 2 SJ on grass and 1 XC warmup. On all 3 ocassions he was excited, tearing around and not listening to me in the slightest. They were reasonable sized slips but they felt controlled and he was able to recover and rebalance (and then think better of tearing around and not listening ).
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Join! (free) 
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
) was as a green four year old, on wet grass, in a spook, in canter. That was mostly my fault as he unbalanced me and I tipped him over with my weight 
. He has never been shod - perhaps that makes a difference?
(til it rained)!
) came in with mud packed feet last night, and I couldn't help noticing that it was packed to wall level rather than shoe level, ie the tread was still there.
